AAR with AWS, observations and opinions, for Rats

[Frantish]

S! 617.

Since we have been with AWS for 2 camps now, just need OBSERVATIONS about it, with AAR of missions.

I want to use material to build a case to change it.

Opinions wanted, but PLEASE check your emotions at the door (looks at Ben )

Humor, OTOH, is welcome. (Hoping Ben has some good ones, but expecting them from Thor)

GL!

[Lure]

I have nothing negative to say about AWS as we have it today. It's all good.

-AWS got a good balance between update speed and area covarage. You know where ea are but not exactly where. A lone ea is still hard to find.

-Easier to find air-action. You can see where the enemy is flying around and the enemy can see you coming.

-It's taken the airwar to a whole new level where teamwork and tactics are much more important then before. The field is now open for squad vs. squad fighting and not just zerg fighter sweeps.

-Skirters can be hunted down if you want.

-Flying around unescorted bombers on RDP missions is real dangerous now, just like it should be.

-Easier to plan your operations as CAS bomber. That is, you can see straight away if there's any idea to bring a bomber to AO X or if you better stay on ground.

-Fighters have started to fly much higher. I have noticed this a lot flying low level CAS. The experienced enemy fighter pilots are much more reluctant now to come down to low altitude. Flying the Havoc/DB7 intruder style at treetop level is actually more safe now IMO.

-Lone wolf vulchers/barcap now need to actually do some work and show some skill in the tactic department to get their kills.

I could go on and on. AWS is the best feature for the airforces since I started playing WWIIOnline back 2004. It's 100% good. IMO this feature will attract new sim-pilots to join the game.

[allibone]

I have nothing negative to say about AWS as we have it today. It's all good.

Can we demote him?

Have you been flying recently with us Lure when the Axis interceptors have been able to track us from our origin AF and jump us 40klm behind the front lines? Even with the 15+ escorts we had, we got hammered. Not only were they able to track the 1st flight, they also successfully intercepted the 2nd flight that lifted 10mins later and tracked it across the map and bounced it too.

The fact that we Allied or Axis can be traxked form takeoff is a gameplay killer for RDP runs. We had success on Friday and Saturday night as there were no large Axis squads lifting against us, but on Sunday nioght we got pummelled by hordes of interceptors.

AWS actively discourages large RDP flights as the red squares draw attention escpecially when they are coming 160klm behind the front lines.

[thor]

I can only think of:
small flights - yellow squares - spread out to cover several squares. We can join flights on egress - if thats any point... I now CRS wanted huge bomber flights (at least that's what they said) but this ass think is killing all major bomber formations...
- we could have huge formations of many small flights spread out - also diffrent alt. So one grid goes red, but we fill all grid





(God I'm drunk allready... cooool)

[Frantish]

(God I'm drunk allready... cooool)

Noted: Get drunk, have A$$

[Charlie3]

as far as i am concerned, i like it when it comes to CAS

but in terms of rdp... look how often we do one large clusterfuck formation to go bomb factories nowadays

doesn't happen anymore. tell the story of how the dambusters changed strategy to deal with it

[Lure]

I have nothing negative to say about AWS as we have it today. It's all good.

Can we demote him?

Have you been flying recently with us Lure when the Axis interceptors have been able to track us from our origin AF and jump us 40klm behind the front lines? Even with the 15+ escorts we had, we got hammered. Not only were they able to track the 1st flight, they also successfully intercepted the 2nd flight that lifted 10mins later and tracked it across the map and bounced it too.

The fact that we Allied or Axis can be traxked form takeoff is a gameplay killer for RDP runs. We had success on Friday and Saturday night as there were no large Axis squads lifting against us, but on Sunday nioght we got pummelled by hordes of interceptors.

AWS actively discourages large RDP flights as the red squares draw attention escpecially when they are coming 160klm behind the front lines.

Adapt to the new system.

Don't take of from a far rear AF. Use already active AFs and circle the AF gaining alt. Hide in the AWS created by fighters around the frontline AOs.

Don't get stuck in old tactics. Adapt to the new system.

And escorts is not just about numbers any more. They got to start to use tactics. A pick-up-group of ramdom fighter pilots joining a RDP raid is just not worth much for escort any more. They need to start working togheter as a team.

If you don't want to run into enemy aircrafts you're playing the wrong game.

[allibone]

Yes we can do that, but the fact that we have to is bullshit.

If we don't lift from a rear AF then we have little chance of having enough escort aircraft available as they are usually depleted.

No-one ever said we don't like running into enemy aircraft, we just don't like running into enemy aircraft that are already waiting at 9 or 10klm over OUR airspace. I am an escort pilot, I hate it when we don't run into EA.

Have you actually flown any RDP runs with us this campaign to be able to form such an accurate opinion.

[hiiamben]

Lure you are entitled to your view bud, but your point of view isnt what we are about!! We are an rdp bombing squad that is our goal our job our 1 main factor we contribute to the allied side.!! Here i am posting in protest of aws in it's current state all over the forum's!! When you say you like it it just undermines what im tyring to accomplish with ahc and crs on getting it changed. If it doesn't change then this squad will loose its effectiveness it has in this game plain and simple!! We are the 1's who have become a thorn in crs's side since we changed the whole rdp concept for them!! So i'm asking for the sake of the squad's future and rdp bombing future alive to please not post positive things about AWS in the kiddie forum's!!

[Reddog]

OMFG

Ben that was good. You didn't get mad or scream. Your sentences were structured, and it actually made sense GFJ.

I/the squad are all for developing new tactics, we have been doing that for a while.

What is required for this new effort is not flying tactics, NO, it's

Some Fooking way to herd 20+ escorts and 20+ bombers into a organized flying machine.Where you don't spend a fooking hour or more begging/spamming players for help on the run.

Then the endless what's my orders, what alt are we hitting , what tgt are we hitting, how do I bomb, how do I set my site, What is a waypoint, What is Teamspeak, How do I center my site, and the Awesome , When the F*** do we lift. Followed by explaining the newfangled route tactics caused by this new fangled ASS system where every fooking body can see every fooking body.

And then once you've lifted and you pretty much identified the 20% that lifted and didn't get all the good info because the text messages flew by faster than movie credits on a rerun TV show, and they are behind and not on course.

Only to be greeted by escorts getting banged that lifted,yep 5 minutes before you.

Yep AWS(ASS) is just awesome.

The game changed before Tools could be put in place too make organizing a cluster**ck like the Rats and the Community are looking for in the air to be assembled reasonably without the WTF insanity, that this new system imposes now always. Before it was only when large runs were formed.

Large runs have always Been a WTF insanity moment. We all have gone crazy trying to form them. They are not fun..

Maybe Lure should try leading say 20-30 of us to target using new tactics and have us safely get there and back while being hit 30k behind the frontline while just getting above 3k, then regroup the group continue the climb, make it thru the frontline, hit target and actually have damage.

I tell you it's a whooping good time.

IMHO unless someone comes up with a easy way to get noobs, fighters and bombers to know their part without a 1200 lines of text messages and a hour + sitting on the field, there isn't going to be much RDP.

I'm not afraid to try something new, let me just run down something I/we have tried.

1.Posting messages/emails detailing operations for the community to join Weeks in advance. Sounds great on paper until 100 people join in going what do I do..Damage has mostly been on the weak side on the big runs.

2. Built a website with detailed videos , pictures, books detailing how to bomb in the game.

I'm always open , but this game is swinging more to Easy mode and people just aren't that interested in investing all there time trying to figuring all this RDP stuff. They just want there kill/points.


So we'll see ASS might be good for CAS , But it Sucks for RDP.

Sorry Rant off, Steps off

[Brey]

...

[Sniper62]

wow reddog, looks like your right about bens post LOL but just dang! ive never saw you type that much lol good going cuz thats just how it is

[thor]

You and Ben, Reddog. You and Ben... We luve you both

[Ma]

A couple of personal 'piss-me-offs':

A system designed to encourage big air battles that has effectively caused us to splinter into mutliple flights of 1-5 planes per grid in order to show a yellow grid moving across a map.

With this, the biggest aspect of the RDP game now is the colors red and yellow.

After having made bombing much harder, dare I say impossible, at high pop hours, we still have the marginal benefit and near non-existant increase in RDP impact. Whoop-dee f***ing doo.

Now that we basically carry some sort of beacon on our planes we still have useless tailguns. The vast majority of escorts are so used to their easy-mode game that the bulk of fighters that pass by them run from one bomber to the next with sheer impunity. DBs and Havocs weren't specific for this role but until we get something bigger how about an upgrade to those TGs Frantish is always on about.


While it increases the fun for the fighter pilots the ONLY real game designed for bombers is now worthless and near impossible. Relying on the dedicated few to just go up because they need to reminisce about the old days when it meant something.


This whole system was designed primarily to prevent skirting, assist people in finding air to air fights, get large scale air battles.

All of this is for the fighter jock with every intention of shafting the bombers.

How about some love?

How about:

Better bombs
Increased (or re-vamped) effects of RDP on the game
TG enhancements
Increased radar misreporting
Increased grid size
Non-reporting outside of X miles from the "front"

Bomber Community Verdict: F*ck bombing.

[Frantish]

Ma, I have already been on the Rats about the AWS splintering the raids.

As for the list, we have to keep chipping away at it.

Chipping away, as in choosing our battles carefully, keeping the topic alive and HOT, and when its taken care of, pick the next one.

It greatly helps to focus on easy fixes then more coding.

The latest Rat post about changing EWS I would like to think I was able to help in getting to the front.

We need to focus on AWS now, RDP second.